Why fight Destiny?

In the Aeneid, Juno knows that people from Troy will bring the end to her beloved city, Carthage. However, she delays Aeneus trips and tries to mess him up all the way even though she knows that Carthage is destined to fall. The question is why fight the inevitable. But why fight? Towards the end, Juno knows that her city is going to fall and enjoys Aeneus's pain to help her deal with hers. As humans, we ourselves try to fight the inevitable and it is a clear parallel between Juno and humans in the sense that everyone wants to go down fighting. Most humans are vengeful when it comes to the people they love and in my opinion Juno may not be in the right but she is rebelling against destiny which is hopeless but admirable. Destiny may be against us but the last thing that humans lose is hope.

PS i commented on "the affair."

From Spirit come the races of man and beast...

'From Spirit come the races of man and beast,
The life of birds, odd creatures the deep sea
Contains beneath her sparkling surfaces,
And fiery energy from a heavenly source
Belongs to the generative seeds of these,
So far as they are not poisoned or clogged
By mortal bodies, their free essence dimmed
By earthiness and deathliness of flesh.'

This is such a fascinating passage to me, for in this view 'the Spirit' is somewhat pantheistic in that is in all things and connects all things; it is also what every being returns to in death. This relates interestingly to Plato, for according to him, the spiritual is the actual reality. So for both, the physical is not permanent, but a blocking or poisoning of the essence of mankind. Once again, we see the potential window of influence Plato's thought had on Virgil. This belief that there is no need to fear death because of the resulting peace has certainly influenced our christian thought today.

Losing the fight.

I am in love with the Anead.

soldiers,
brave as you are to no end, if you crave
to face the last fight with me, and no doubt of it,
how matters stand for us each no one can see.
The gods who by this kingdom stood are gone,
Gone from the shrines and altars. You defend
a city lost in flames.come, let us die,
we'll make a rush into the thick of it.
The conqured have one safety: hope for none.

One of the most beautiful things about this story, to me, is the portrayal of war. I love it. I don't even know what to say about it other than it's brilliant. I think there's something so noble about fighting when the 'gods have departed'. Maybe because it seems like something our culture has lost. I mean we want to win- always. it's hard to comprehend fighting for the sake of something you know is lost. And yet I think it's kind of beautiful. It's like fighting for something bigger than yourself. It's a spiritual redemption of a physical fall.

The Affair

The affair of Dido and Aeneas is a curious one. It is not to different from modern-day relationships. As humans, we so many times give into our lustful nature, and that is exactly what Dido and Aeneas did. We see at the end of book four how that turned out for them. Aeneas leaves, and Dido is so heart broken over his departure she kills herself. What good does adultery provide? None. It brings deceit and heart break into life. In Song of Solomon, the beloved says, "Oh daughters of Israel, I charge you: Do not awaken love until it so pleases." She says this in three different places (2:7, 3:5, and 8:4). I presume that if she feels the need to say this on so many different occasions it's probably something we should live by. I believe their behavior was uncalled for, and they see this through the consequences of their actions. 

PS. I commented on Michelle's "The Underworld"

Aeneas as a Leader

One of the qualities that I admire the most in Aeneas is his leadership. Many great leaders love their men and are extremely tactful in battle. The difference that sets Aeneas apart from other great leaders is his compassion. This can be argued in the case of his relationship with Dido, but with his men there is no doubt. He is deeply affected when he looses one of his men. He mourns the most for Misenus when they find his body. If Aeneas asks his men to do something he is right beside them working just as hard to show them he is not just going to command them to do something and then not do it himself. Many leaders can take this power to the extreme and that is when they become tyrants. Aeneas does not want to hold his power over his men as a threat. Through Aeneas' compassion and actions, I believe he shows the best qualities of a leader.

P.S.- I commented on Katelyn Ewing's post.

Oh Dido

    Tonight I want to write about Dido.  This is the character that broke my heart, I totally wanted to take her side. She, seems, like a innocent victim.   Queen Dido is a the type of woman I would like to be, until at least an Aeneid comes into the picture.  She is well-rounded Roman woman, I mean Phoenician.  She is kind, compassionate, gracious to strangers, looks out for the good of her people. Her kingdom is happy place, busy and alive, constructing and growing, they are also up to date on current events, they serve the gods regularly.   She also has had hardships and misfortunes, so she can relate to Aeneis.  Clearly, this is a strong lady.
    Then the gods, as usual, have to go and mess with people. Dido for so long has only loved her deceased husband, but when Cupid comes, he makes her fall in love with Aeneas.  Her and Aeneas have an affair, which in her mind is a marriage. Aeneas is reminded of his mission, he leaves her.  Dido, heartbroken, falls into what is clearly a depression.  Her she has been robbed of her honor, her glory and her heart, all she gave fully to him.  Aeneas made her a tarnished woman, and now she not a fit queen.  She's left with the anger of previous suitors, an unfinished wall to protect her people, and a broken spirit.  How could one not fall into a depression?
    Killing herself was not something that impressed me, after Aeneas left, she couldn't shake him. Life was no longer worth living, and she forgot about her people, her kingdom and her sister.
   Dido, however, taught me a lesson. People can be incredible leaders, but by putting their trust in man, their lives will come to ruin. Also that the consequences of your decisions never affect solely yourself.

P.S. commented on Sam's post

Bitter Much?

One of the most interesting things that I came across in the Aeneid was the fact that Juno continued to pursue revenge on Aeneas regardless of the fact that he was fated to prevail in the end. I hate to keep ranting on the same subjects, but I could not help but getting almost frustrated at the tension between the Gods and different cosmic orders caused by their oh so human frailty. For the whole of the story up until her turnaround in book twelve, she continues to seek spiteful revenge simply because Paris had chosen Venus as the more beautiful of the two and the prophecy concerning the Romans and Carthage.   I understand that when Juno finally yields in the end and simply asks that the Latin name and language be kept,  she is, in a sense, bringing about the resolution of the story by ceasing to continue being the primary antagonist against Aeneas. My problem still remains though, that I just can't respect a god harboring that bitter a grudge against a mortal for those reasons. Although these epic tales all make great stories, I guess I'll just never be able to come to terms with their gods being so pitifully human.

PS I commented on Katelyn Ewing's

Infants in the Underworld

I'm not sure that this is a normal response, and I don't know if this detail of the underworld is really even important in the rest of the text, but in book VI around line 575 those who passes away as infants are mentioned, and I felt really bad for these children.  The first thing I noticed was the sound of the infants' wailing could be heard.  Therefore, those who died in infancy were probably destined to exist in the underworld as infants, both physically and mentally; however, if this were not the case, they were forced to exist knowing of the life that they never had the opportunity to experience. Neither situation pleasant in my eyes.  They were deprived of the opportunity to ever learn and grow.  When I picture this scene, I imagine as the infant spirits crying alone without their mothers or any type of caregiver or nurturer.  Compared with the picture that I would assume most Christians hold about the afterlife of those who pass away in infancy, it seems to me to be a drastically different situation.

P.S. I commented on Molly Gray's "Changing the Names."

Poor Little Me

I had been feeling sorry for Dido. Her first husband was murdered by her brother; she was made to fall in love against her will, and the man she loved eventually left her. Dido faced some hard situations. But this was no excuse for some of her actions. Aeneas had to leave; neither one of them could disregard the will of the gods. But, out of selfish love, she demanded that Aeneas stay with her. When he insisted that he had to go, she insulted him. When it became evident that he wasn't coming back, she got her sister to unknowingly make preparations for suicide. The sister was forced to watch Dido kill herself. These are not loving actions. Dido did feel genuinely hurt, but some of her actions were just selfish.

I commented on emilylaforce's post.

The Importance of Burial

While reading past epics such as the Odyssey I never really understood why burial was extremely important until reading The Aeneid.  I realized that one of the reasons the soldiers would fight over the fallen bodies so they could have a proper burial was so they would receive honor, but I felt there was more to it.  When Aeneas makes his trip to the underworld he encounters the souls of the unburied. Sibyl informs Aeneas that the souls of the unburied are not allowed to cross the river into the underworld.  They have to wait until either their bones are buried in the ground or wait one hundred years on the banks of the river before they are allowed to cross.  Aeneas unfortunately encounters Palinurus( his helmsman who was pitched overboard and was killed by savages when he finally go to the shore of Italy) as one of the unburied souls and Palinurus begs Aeneas to "deliver him from his captivity."  I never really understood this part of the underworld until reading this.  If you knew that that is what would happen if you or a loved one wasn't buried you probably would almost fight to the death to give someone a proper burial. This would insure they would have a safe passage to the underworld and not have to wait another one hundred years.  Actually being in the underworld can seem bad enough and then having to wait even longer to enter would be devastating knowing that peace is just across a river.  Thankfully as Aeneas journey went on we were able to see a more pleasurable side to the underworld, which almost makes waiting even harder. Therefore, all the fighting over the bodies to give the people proper burials makes so much more sense because it is not only for their honor but also to gain easy passage to the underworld.

p.s. commented on Molly Gray's Changing the Names

The Underworld

The vision of the underworld portrayed in the Aeneid was far more in detail than that of the Odyssey. The structure and manner in which it was portrayed was exsqisite. The nomadic fields of Elysium where the Lethye takes away the pain of ones past life could represent the lost innocence renewed. Even Tartarus has a structure and rules. There is not the chaos that one comes to expect from death. That could be related to how heaven will be in the Christian's perspective. Our sins and pain of the life we led on Earth will be washed away. The courts in the Roman underworld could also reflect the two judgements fortold in Revelations. There are so many parallels that it is a bit suprising. In the end, death claims us all.  

Deathly Distractions

I find it so interesting how often humans make such simple-minded decisions.  The gods and goddesses entrusted Aeneas with the fate of the Trojans, and he always found a way to let his humanity distract him from his task.  The Aeneid is full of instances where humanity trumps divine revelation, and the irony exists in the fact that Christians do the exact same thing.  It is often assumed that a lack of faith provokes such responses; however, I prefer to believe that these responses are caused by allowing humanity to cloud spiritual discernment.  As a result, Aeneas found himself straying from his destined path throughout the journey to Italy.  By being distracted by his desires, Aeneas made poor decisions that produced deadly results.

Connection vs. Commitment

I found the thoughts on the differences between emotional connection and lasting commitment to someone, very intriguing today. After a quick comment was made about it, I found myself thinking about it throughout the rest of class.
In the case of Dido and Aeneas, we clearly know who felt which way about the other person. Dido was so in love with Aeneas that when she was rejected, she...took it hard, to say the least. Yet Aeneas was sort of "whatever" about that whole thing, the whole time.
What would it have taken Aeneas to get from just an emotion connection to a lasting commitment with Dido? Why didn't he try? Obviously he didn't know Dido was going to take rejection so hard or he probably would've have had anything to do with her. But even still, playing with someones heart is a dangerous business, regardless of whether or not you know the potential consequences of your actions.
So I guess what I kept asking myself was, why don't more people try to get passed the simple emotional connection with someone to a long-lasting commitment? I think if it was something that was more striven for, people would find it much more satisfying then just toying around with emotions.

P.s. I commented on emilylaforc'es "I want it now"

Changing the Names

I, like many others I am sure, was a little thrown off by the transition from the names of the Greek gods, to those of Rome while reading The Aeneid. I personally favor the Greek gods over the Roman, simply because I am more familiar with them, but I quickly realized that I should get more familiar with them- so I made myself a chart. However, while thinking about the change from one culture to another, I thought about the transition from the British culture to that of the US when Merriam Webster decided that he wanted to change the spelling of several words simply to create a further separation form the Old World to the New. The simple change from the word “colour” to “color” was a way to show the establishment of a new power house, just like changing the name of Zeus to Jove, and Hera to Juno was a way for Rome to show the transition of power from Greece.

p.s- I commented on Emily LaForce's "I want it now"

 

I want it now

Something that's prevalent in our society is action without foresight. People act on their emotions without thinking about the consequences. It's amazing to me how Virgil had such insight into human nature. People still use others and then cast them aside when they don't need them anymore or if duty calls them to somewhere else. Obviously, I'm referring to Dido and Aeneas and their love affair. Aeneas definitely acted selfishly because he knew he was fated to leave Carthage and establish a city and yet starts things up with Dido. Oh Cupid, why did you aim your bow at Dido? Although the gods caused Dido to fall in love with Aeneas, I think if Aeneas knew the consequences of his actions (Dido's subsequent suicide and dishonor) he wouldn't have done it. I think Virgil is trying to tell us to have foresight before we act. This could even be applied to college and studying so that when you end up a doctor you won't kill someone on accident cause you don't know what you're doing. also, think about the consequences of your relationships. Maybe your ex won't kill themselves cause you left them. (P.S. Commented on Jamie Kilpatrick's Infants in the underworld)